23: To Stage, or Not to Stage? And the Difference Between Staging & Interior Design

Intro:
Hey, you’re drinking house coffee – unfiltered conversations brewed at the intersection of real estate life and coffee shop service. We’re Maggie and Rich – local business owners and friends sharing stories and welcoming you to pull up a chair with us. The door’s always open. Let us pour you a cup.

Rich:
I had to fire someone last week.

Maggie:
No,

Rich:
It was probably the hardest thing I’ve ever done. fire just fires a strong word fire is a strong word. They really didn’t like Deserve to be fired. You know what? I mean? It was not a this person’s sucks. Like they’re not working out. They don’t. Like it wasn’t a bad thing on their part. It was totally on us. It was like it was like Is like it’s not you it’s me.

Maggie:
Yeah,

Rich:
But story Edition, yeah. for sure, I felt bad because I mean you just you know, nobody likes that I had to do it on the phone. Oh man,

Maggie:
That’s our way of being broken up with

Rich:
Exactly. I’m like You know, I didn’t text it. I did call we did have a conversation. I would have done a person but I’ve never there anymore, you know. Yeah,

Maggie:
And

Rich:
That ultimately was the reason like that was the problem. So basically we had we have We’re in a transitional time right now and we got people. Cast who works for us and right now is our longest standing staff. She got a cool like new job like a big, you know big kid job

Maggie:
And

Rich:
That’s you know gone back and forth for several months. And then it’s finally like okay start date is early October so We knew we had to replace her and other things going on around the shop with just change our hours and and whatever. So just transitional. We’ve been thinking about the Staffing situation. Because we also have Heather she’s our newest. person, but she works also at Fisher Ferry, which is my first kind of like Hybrid Stand, yes, she’s great. So anyway, then we had this other newer person. Reach out to us and she was a regular. Emphasis on was I’m sure we’ll never see her

Maggie:
Again,

Rich:
But she was a regular. who just like like The Vibes and you know good personality energetic and and had filled out or like online staff interest form that I have because I This is a pro tip. All right, I don’t have like an application. Or anything and and we’re never hiring. You know, if you ask are you hiring the answer is no, but I do have on our website a staff interest form. It’s a very low-key. Google form that you can fill out and it’s just like it’s a questionnaire. Okay, and basically It’s just collecting. It’s running in the background collecting people’s information and interest and whatever and so it’s kind of like self-electing people who would be interested in working a story. So it’s a great way to collect potential people. And then when you are looking when you are hiring secretly you have a database of people that you can try to reach out to So anyway, this person should fill this out. And then she emailed us to say hey, I filled that out. Just wanted to make sure it went through. Okay, you know, so I’m like, all right, we got initiative. You know, it’s just good science good signs all around so I’m like, all right. Well, I’m thinking about it. Let me reach out but so we put that all together. So I am never at story anymore because I work in Fisher Ferry and she was not interested in doing both or just not able to do both. So like when Heather started she started officer Ferry with me for a whole week then she went over to to storied plugged in I mean there’s a lot more to learn it stored but Because of the Precision that we we have over there, but anyway long story short. I underestimated. So, okay. That was what I said, the difference was Heather was a Very experienced Barista and that’s the reason I hired her was. I was like, I don’t see resumes like yours Baristas with your skill level are literally imported from other states and she is yeah. She’s from North Carolina. So it’s like, all right. We got you in here. So I hired someone who had zero. zero negative Food Service experience. Okay. I’ve been in food service for 16 years. all of my jobs my first job to my last job has been Food Service except for a little break in the Middle where I did some Ministry, you know, so that’s exactly yes. You have to start somewhere. So it’s like cool we can always we can train anyone. You know what I mean? And the thing is like I’ve always been present to be part of the training. Yeah. Abby has never been the head person training other staff, you know, everyone learns from each other different things for sure. But which goes on is that story is Abby’s that every day Happy’s there every day all day. running a tight chef and people need to be quick to learn. Yeah,

Maggie:
And

Rich:
Kind of have a foundation that they’re building also like Heather. a little bit older Barista experience Food Service experience like like very little there was a lot you could take for granted with her but with someone like the this other person I had hired. There was Zero. You could take for granted. And I took for granted. That reality. And then it just was like a situation where two weeks in. There was I saw the road ahead and it was long the road ahead to like. Getting them getting them. Trained to a level where like they could be a little more independent was just was just so far off in their eyes and we didn’t have we didn’t have the resources to do like Abby doesn’t have that.

Maggie:
Yeah

Rich:
Ability or capacity. Let’s call it a capacity. She could do it with enough time. Like we knew it could work with more time. We just don’t have more time right now. We need someone we can literally plug in on some of our busiest days and like Give a Little Instruction and they can kind of like,

Maggie:
Yeah

Rich:
Into it what to do in certain situations, whatever this person was gonna be like just needing every single thing. handed You know every single thing instructed and it’s like we don’t have that. We don’t have the resources. We don’t have the capacity. We don’t have that infrastructure.

Maggie:
I’m proud of you for making that tough decision because I I can just imagine how difficult it was for you because you You the type of person? Who is like very sensitive to other people’s feelings? And so I’m sure? That it was a it was a really tough conversation.

Rich:
It was nearly

Maggie:
As I can just

Rich:
Oh she was not, you know didn’t expect that per se like

Maggie:
But I mean was probably for the better just like better to happen sooner. Yeah,

Rich:
That was that was my but my thought was like this. It was like as like this. This is one of those things you just know. It’s the right move, you know, it’s the worst move, but it’s the right move. so

Maggie:
I don’t

Rich:
Know what your takeaway is from that but

Maggie:
Take away from that is story is hiring

Rich:
Yeah. Well, yeah, I mean, hey, we got a staff interest form.

Maggie:
Yeah that interest form.

Rich:
Check it out stored coffee. Calm slash. Staff or maybe slash hiring maybe slash. Yeah, obviously, so that’s that’s one little story for you. We I am talking I there are a couple names from that thing that are more recent that okay people reached out. I’ve had three different people now apply who who both have food service experience or interest and book selling what interests and I’m like man this is that like that’s an indicator that we’re yeah on the right track, you know. we’ve got the we’ve got the the people identifying story as a book place. Yeah also as a coffee shop, which is exactly what we’re moving towards so that’s cool. And I’m trying to get the next person trying to get in I would like I’d love for them to have Food Service experience. Yes, you know check check on a couple of these people and then also tap there, like book shop experience because you know we got All those books in there, but they gotta be organized. They gotta be like we gotta figure out how to Market them and and sell them and get in front of people

Maggie:
And answer quite like if you’re somebody likes to read You know you can talk about. Like if someone’s like oh, have you read this book before? They can maybe be like no I haven’t but I know that author or whatever. Yeah,

Rich:
Exactly. Yeah, that’d be great because I collect books but I don’t read them.

Maggie:
Yeah, and I listened to books

Rich:
Exactly but you probably have listened to more books than I have.

Maggie:
I don’t know.

Rich:
Red if I had to guess in life. So anyway, that’s a fun little bummer. Yeah.

Maggie:
Well It’s probably it is probably for the better.

Rich:
It’s for everyone’s sake, you know, I mean, yeah, it’s for everyone’s sake and that’s just it’s Is her full.

Maggie:
Yeah

Rich:
Disappointing. Like I said, I texted Abby I was like I wouldn’t expect to see her again, you know, but anyway.

Maggie:
It’s so funny. I ran into my old boss. at a local restaurant one time recently very recently. I worked for a small startup. in my early 20s and I was let go after six months and I was devastated. devastated like it was just it was awful, but it was actually for the better. Yeah,

Rich:
Like

Maggie:
If I’d stayed working at that company. It was a software development company. What would I have done in a software development company wouldn’t have started a home staging business.

Rich:
Yeah. Well,

Maggie:
You know but luckily like I I’m we were very cordial. He actually bought me in Brandon a drink. It was really nice and but it’s so funny because when he was having he was having drinks with somebody else. I think he was like a local.

Rich:
Oh, you mean like recently recently when you’re random

Maggie:
Yes

Rich:
Anybody guys drinks?

Maggie:
Yes,

Rich:
That’s nice.

Maggie:
Yeah like a month ago

Rich:
Nice touch.

Maggie:
And he was having drinks with someone. I didn’t recognize our dinner at the bar and he he introduced me and Brandon and like we were like laughing and stuff and he he said something like off the cuff like yeah, and then she we were so horrible. She decided to quit or whatever and I wanted to be like No, like you are totally changing this narrative like, you know, you let me go why just why like try to save face in front of everybody? Yeah that like I quit whereas like that was definitely not the case.

Rich:
Yeah, but

Maggie:
Yeah. Anyways, that was just like it’s just it was it was like you’ll run into her and if like the person you’re talking about you probably won’t cross paths again. and it might be awkward and whatever whatever but like You know.

Rich:
Yeah,

Maggie:
As long as like you’re like cordial or whatever and like you can get past this and she’s not the type of person to like. You know leave a bad review Google

Rich:
Probably not. She’s she’s super sweet. Nice.

Maggie:
Yeah,

Rich:
You know and would have been she had the energy level like there’s just so much that was good and it just was not. Yeah, we could that’s gonna be tenable though on our and

Maggie:
Sorry for your loss.

Rich:
Thank you.

Maggie:
What he was just gonna ask it. What have I been listening to? Okay, you’d be you beat me. Okay, I have been I have two things. Have you heard you probably have but When you were a young lad, did you listen to Dashboard Confessional? Sure

Rich:
Did

Maggie:
Okay

Rich:
Still do

Maggie:
Really? Okay, cool. Wow, that’s like the first time I’ve we’ve I think we’ve ever like Um, well it’s like it’s very moody music.

Rich:
Yes. Yeah, it’s some of the original

Maggie:
Yes.

Rich:
I don’t know if it’s the some of the original email but as early on like

Maggie:
Yeah

Rich:
Or like to that like the year 2000. Yes.

Maggie:
Okay,

Rich:
One of his first records that yes I had.

Maggie:
So I was growing on Instagram as one does and someone I follow had hands down as like the background music and I was like it instantly brought me back. to a time and place in my life And so I was like I need to I need to like listen to this to like just be done with it and get it out. And so for like a day, I was just listening to Dashboard Confessional and like

Rich:
That’s great

Maggie:
My car like really like screaming infidelities and like all the like Classics and then I started hearing some of like the like crossover songs. Like he they did a they did a crossover with post Malone. I was like, wow, that’s pretty cool. Anyways, but so that’s one thing. I’ve been listening to listening to and then the other thing I completely binged neglecting all of my responsibilities for the day. Just to finish this podcast. I literally binged it in one whole day and I am not sorry about it. It’s called scamanda. And it’s you can find it wherever you listen to podcasts. Highly recommend. It was like it was on the edge of my seat and like finding myself like like Bop in my head to the theme music and like oh, I want to listen to the next episode. With I mean without giving too much away. the podcast is about this young woman who? Is diagnosed with cancer and like starts blogging about it? and something about her diagnosis isn’t adding up and like people start looking into it and it’s you just gotta listen to it to hear this. It’s him and scamanda. Yeah. Her name is her name is Amanda. Amanda C Riley and

Rich:
I’ve heard that name really say it.

Maggie:
No, she was in the news.

Rich:
Yeah,

Maggie:
It was it was big story when it broke. She yeah. So

Rich:
Anywho. Yeah

Maggie:
Find it listen to it, please if you listen to it, please email us or email me at House Coffee podcast at Gmail and just let’s Because so many people have dm’d me about it and I’m like I just yeah, it’s so so good

Rich:
Who put it out.

Maggie:
Um, I want to say like novel but I’m not sure it’s it’s Don’t quote me on that. It’s it was a produced very well produced

Rich:
Series and

Maggie:
With audio like her own audio and then they have voice actors who are actually who are actually reading. past blog posts of hers which is so crazy because What ended up being her downfall was all these blog posts that she posted? Yeah, which anyways is nutty

Rich:
About how many episodes

Maggie:
9.

Rich:
All right, that’s manageable.

Maggie:
Very

Rich:
Magical. Yeah, you do it today.

Maggie:
Yeah,

Rich:
Are they like an hour longer?

Maggie:
Some of them are they’re between like 30 and 60 Minutes long?

Rich:
Okay. Chewable. Yeah,

Maggie:
Definitely. Like I said, I think I finished it in like seven or eight hours it was. I like the last at the last 20 minutes of the last episode. I sat in my car in my driveway listening to it because I like I didn’t want to stop and get out of my car.

Rich:
Funny cool. I mean, it’s cool to have things are engrossing like that. Yeah.

Maggie:
Even listening to Rich

Rich:
I recently listened to upon the recommendation of a friend the 200th episode of a Beautiful Mess. Do you know?

Maggie:
Tell me more

Rich:
Familiar with that podcast, like

Maggie:
Only my favorite podcast ever.

Rich:
Were you the friend that recommended it to me

Maggie:
Possibly

Rich:
Just kidding.

Maggie:
So many of your friends you were listening to that. I was you probably were recommended multiple times

Rich:
And that was cool because we just did our 20th.

Maggie:
Yeah

Rich:
Retrospective. They did their 200th retrospective.

Maggie:
Mm-hmm.

Rich:
So I was kind of like comparing notes. Yeah them on that. Obviously they have an extremely well-established. Podcast and following. I mean I looked at LC’s account just because I follow her and it popped up on Instagram right after I listen to this. I was like and then I noticed she got like 4504,000 followers just on her own, you know. and then I just thinking about the scale of things, you know talk about the scale and like the way they do their podcast made me think a little bit because it’s like This is how people with it with a strong with a robust Community around. A podcast Mighty do it, you know and it felt like the kind of thing that that there’s probably a lot of give and take on with their listeners. Based on the different solicitations they make and things that they talk about and also the things that they do. that they reference so like segments or whatever you want to call them just elements of their podcasts that seem to be like read like on a repeat thing. Repeat basis like they talk about their comfort rewatches and they do like a book club and stuff too.

Maggie:
Right?

Rich:
So there’s just like things that are built into the life of cycle of their Their episodes or the seasons or whatever. that’s had me reflecting on like the way these things can kind of take shape. Over time and I mean 200 are they weekly

Maggie:
Yeah,

Rich:
Maybe they’re taking breaks or whatever on the way but

Maggie:
The past they have taken like summer breaks. But I don’t believe they plan on taking like long breaks going forward

Rich:
Got it

Maggie:
Because I think it kills their momentum.

Rich:
Yeah. I mean if you know that yeah, so

Maggie:
They all so batch record. They’re very okay open about that. Their back record they record probably. Two to three episodes in one sitting so they probably have a like a set recording day,

Rich:
Right? So

Maggie:
I mean, it’s what end of September right now. They probably have all of their recordings up until Halloween already done.

Rich:
Yeah.

Maggie:
If I had to guess

Rich:
Which is jinx. Hey, which is smart because you have to it’s it’s part of their career. It’s part of their like that’s their job.

Maggie:
Yes,

Rich:
Their job is to make content

Maggie:
And

Rich:
Curate this community or facilitate this community and having a podcast on it really basis is As part of that so when your whole life revolves around certain things you just build your life around that yeah, that makes sense. That makes sense. It’s also efficient.

Maggie:
The reason I sent it to you is because I really liked how they pointed out the differences between like how they communicate to people on their Instagram feed and on their blog versus the podcast. Yeah, and it removed it reminded like really inspired me and it kind of reiterated that you and I are on the right track with House Coffee because I feel like this is a way for us to get more personal with our audience and share things on the podcast that we are not going to share on our Instagram or like website or whatever and so I I was like wow, okay, so that is kind of the right this long form. podcasting or influencing whatever space is a lot is like feels comfortable for me as opposed to being on the feed all day every day.

Rich:
Right. Yeah that there’s a good distinction. Let me sense and it kind of do the same thing. Like they each have their own respective brand around their personalities.

Maggie:
Yes,

Rich:
And then they have the Beautiful Mess. brand,

Maggie:
Right

Rich:
Which which lends us off to the podcast and we kind of are like we kind of do the same thing. Yeah, each of our own Brands and then this is the place where those brands. Speak their

Maggie:
Minds exactly

Rich:
And the people behind them show their faces.

Maggie:
Sure

Rich:
Preferably. Yes.

Maggie:
Yes totally. So

Rich:
That’s a good point. Yeah, and you know, I think it was good to hear. I think it was LC talking about like on Instagram. She she has to be a little more fake, you know, you have to be a little more fake on Instagram or like because you have or in or even in writing you just can’t help but edit that as you go or like you learn the hard way. You need to edit it based on. Poor feedback, but like mean feedback or whatever. but on the on the mic you can just

Maggie:
So the voice is different when you’re speaking something

Rich:
Right

Maggie:
As opposed to writing something. Yeah,

Rich:
That was a Schmid that point so that’s cool as insightful. Thanks for sharing that

Maggie:
Mhm. So

Rich:
Shout out to yeah, Beautiful Mess for 20 episodes. Congrats guys.

Maggie:
Yeah, we’ll get there was

Rich:
I know you’re listening to I guess you can receive that. Yeah. Well today we’re gonna hear from you Maggie.

Maggie:
Yeah, I can’t wait.

Rich:
We have an intriguing question.

Maggie:
Yes,

Rich:
We’re gonna talk some staging stuff.

Maggie:
I’m here for it.

Rich:
Um, yeah, and you know, it’s cool because I I do a lot of talking on this mic in my in my estimation. So, um, To Stage or not to Stage.

Maggie:
That is the question.

Rich:
You

Maggie:
Stage houses. Yes,

Rich:
Which we’ve talked about the past.

Maggie:
Yep,

Rich:
How you got into that what that kind of means quick briefest recap of

Maggie:
Okay

Rich:
What it is you do

Maggie:
Good, so I have a real estate business where I buy and sell houses for with my clients. And I also have a separate staging business called Welcome Home Co. and welcome home Co is Custom tailored staging to help you with selling your home to make you feel. Lived in and loved and that is something that I’ve been kind of doing. I looked back since probably real real like actual full-on staging since 2018. and it’s like I’m finally owning it and and I made the distinction actually recently because I was at an estate sale and I was talking to I in the past I had when I would talk to people about staging I would say. Oh, I do staging and I would just kind of say like, oh, I do staging I do staging. And it never dawned on me until someone was like oh, who do you work for? Who do you who do you who’s the company? What’s the company you work for and I was like myself and they’re like, oh you you have the business you’re you own a staging business and I was like and so like that distinction was so important for me to realize because now when I talk to people about it, Instead of saying I do staging I’m like I want to staging business. Which is totally different. Yeah, and it comes out totally different than I do stay doing it’s like kind of feels like I almost didn’t want to like take ownership of it.

Rich:
But

Maggie:
Now very proudly I’m like I own a staging business, right

Rich:
And

Maggie:
I’m buying this for my my inventory.

Rich:
Yeah, that’s cool.

Maggie:
Yeah,

Rich:
Thanks. Shout out to that.

Maggie:
Yeah,

Rich:
So yeah, there’s something that conversation.

Maggie:
It’s just crazy how like that little tweak in the language.

Rich:
No, sometimes things just click in a way when somebody yes in a different puts a spin on it, you know,

Maggie:
Right.

Rich:
Well, okay, that’s that’s super cool and you can hear more about me journey into staging in previous episodes. Yes. So what we were we were kind of like we were asking ourselves. Brainstorming topics and things and we thought about when you might stage versus when you might not stage. and the question was is it better to stage a house with quote unquote crappy furniture and I’ll leave it to you to define the threshold on that. But is it better to Stage a house with crappy furniture? than to Not stage it at all.

Maggie:
That is a great question. So this is an actual question that was asked and I’ve been thinking about it. A little bit more since I answered it to that person. and I was actually my brother who asked me and I have been thinking about it a little bit more. and it I the I gave him a short answer, but I wanted to maybe elaborate that in a little bit more because to Stage a home, so If the question you’re kind of already, assuming that if that this house is empty. So

Rich:
Why would say more about that a little bit?

Maggie:
Well, that was staging.

Rich:
Typically is like staging is like when when the house is. Up for sale. Yeah, and it’s Presumed to be is it true that in most cases and houses gonna be empty. Yeah,

Maggie:
When

Rich:
Staging services are

Maggie:
Yes 90% of the time I’m staging a vacant house so that person

Rich:
90% of the time. Okay,

Maggie:
That’s my experience. Yeah other staging companies may be different but most of the time people want staging because it enhances the look of a house in photographs and it helps the experience when you’re in person staging a house is important because In the main living areas and bedrooms. It’s helpful to get a good concept of what can fit in the space. Yeah. So if you walk into an empty living room, it’s tough to tell. Oh, well will my sectional sofa fit here or well my desk fit here and especially in bedrooms at minimum bedrooms are very important to Stage because People think in the context of the size of their bed. so like most couples who are buying a house together, they’ll be they’ll like if they walk into an empty room. They’ll be like hmm. What a king size bed fit in here. Or would a queen size bed fit in here? And so when I stage houses, I actually label the size beds I use so that people can see like this is a king size bed because then they can compare it to what they have at home and if it will fit in the space. so at the very minimum it’s important to have. Bedroom staged because people are always buyers, especially they want to know if their bed will fit. Everything else you can kind of leave up to the imagination, but it’s it’s still important to have at least the basics. now staging a house like let’s say You’re Gonna sell you have a house to sell. and you have like really beat up furniture. Like I don’t know you have pets or kids or You smoke, you know, yeah,

Rich:
All

Maggie:
Those different factors come into place. I I would so to Stage a house with crappy Furniture Otis stage it empty. in this specific case I would leave I would get all the furniture out of the house. It is better to leave a house empty. with no furniture than to Stage it with crappy furniture, and the reason is perception is everything if if you have crappy Furniture, that’s beat up that has stains on it that has like smell that kind of has odors from like your kids or your pets or smoking or whatever. That’s all people are gonna see they’re just gonna notice the bad Furniture you have that’s ripped up or torn or worse. And it completely takes away from what you’re actually selling which is the house. Furniture like staging furniture is supposed to enhance the space. in fact when I stage with Joe oftentimes we will have a not a debate but we’ll go back and forth of whether or not we want to put something on the wall or leave the wall blink or put a pillow on the sofa because you’re not supposed to notice the furniture in photos. That’s that’s my philosophy when I’m staging. I don’t want people to really notice the furniture. I want people. My job, I’m hired to sell help sell the house. So if the furniture is a distraction. I think this the case is the same is like should you use? elaborate sparkly amazingly like what’s the word? I’m looking for like expensive furniture or leave it empty and I would probably I I think I have the same answer for that like If it’s a distraction from what you’re trying to sell which is the house then leave it out. And I don’t know put painters tape on the floor in in the shape of a bed or a sofa. I honestly feel like that’s

Rich:
In that done.

Maggie:
No, but

Rich:
Maybe potential buyers,

Maggie:
But I mean, that’s what I do. Sometimes when I’m measuring for furniture. I was I’ll just like right like measure out the dimensions and then put painters tape on the floor. Yeah, I do that when I’m hanging stuff on the walls, too. sometimes like some not all the time, but I feel like it’s better to do that than to. Put excessive furniture or worse like terrible Furniture in a space.

Rich:
Got it. Well, there’s your how to take people.

Maggie:
Yeah, that’s my hot take and the solution so you might be thinking like Maggie you just you stayed home. Like why would you want to you just spent the first, you know few minutes just talking about the importance of staging and my solution to that is if if you’re selling a home and all you have is beat up furniture. Rather, I mean you can hire someone like me and I will come in stage the home. You could go out and curate and get your own furniture and stage. But more than likely people who are selling a house. They don’t want to deal with that hassle. So there are programs out there online. That will virtually stage a photo for you. So you can still go forward and take the photographs or hire the photographer to take your take the photographs and you can send the photographs to a company like box Brownie and companies like box brownie not sponsored. But hey, if you want to, you know, just you know, They will they will Photoshop photos. I mean Furniture into the photos. and And it’s like a cost per photo. So if you have a bedroom or a living room or whatever, you can have them virtually staged with photographs. In in my market in the capital region upstate, New York. If you virtually stage a photo you have to include the vacant photo as well in the listing photos and you have to say in the photo that it’s been virtually staged. so, but I think that’s better than Doing nothing

Rich:
At all. That’s cool. Did you say that was a Requirement in New York to have those uh,

Maggie:
I don’t know if it’s a state requirement. It’s a requirement in my multiple listing service like my area like when we list photos online if it’s been virtually staged we have to disclose that in the photo like a little Mark like this has been virtually

Rich:
Staged

Maggie:
And then we have to show the photo of the same room but empty.

Rich:
Yeah, that’s cool. I mean fair enough that makes sense. How common is virtual staging do you find?

Maggie:
Ah, it’s pretty

Rich:
Most people opt for that if they’re not going to do something like

Maggie:
People opted for that because it’s quicker.

Rich:
Totally

Maggie:
On but it’s to me it’s it’s I don’t find it to be the the best solution. I’ve seen house I’ve seen photos that were virtually staged where they painted the walls. In the photos, so like let’s say the photos in person and we’re like a very ugly color. Yeah, they’ll virtually stage it with a new paint color to show like this is what the space could look like. In

Rich:
The whole.

Maggie:
Yeah, they’ll go the whole way with it, which is why you have to do both you have to show what the space actually is. You can’t doctor a photo to be what it’s not sure because we’re not trying they don’t want you to like hide flaws.

Rich:
Yeah, that makes sense and it’s like I mean same thing, you know, you want people to know what you’re selling,

Maggie:
Right? Yes,

Rich:
Like we said before.

Maggie:
Also if a house is staged with crappy furniture and The house itself is actually in pretty decent shape. It takes away from the workmanship and the like actual cool features of the house. I mean the whole point is to sell the house. And so if it’s just if you’re distracted by The crappy furniture or the over the top Furniture. That’s all people are gonna see in the photos. They’re not going to see the house or the the tile on the floor or the backsplash or the kitchen cabinets or The features that you’re trying to highlight about the home.

Rich:
Sure.

Maggie:
Yeah. and if the house is occupied by someone and they want me to stage. Sometimes I’ll be all like I helped stage a home once where they still lived there, but they were very minimal and they were willing to remove a couple pieces and like put them in the garage and like I replaced them with something that I had

Rich:
Sure. So

Maggie:
It was like kind of like a Modular stage I don’t know if modular is right word, but hybrid hybrid. Thank you. He’s like hybrid staging so

Rich:
They had enough good stuff that Fitness well with the space, but they still had room to work with you.

Maggie:
Yes

Rich:
On Like to collaborate with yeah,

Maggie:
They had some a lot of good core pieces.

Rich:
That’s cool.

Maggie:
I was able to that’s

Rich:
His

Maggie:
Fit in the space.

Rich:
What is every job? difference in terms of like it’s obviously in terms of design but intern do you kind of like estimated job? Are you like a contractor you go in you’re like, alright, that’s gonna be this work this amount of time. Do you have like your like a rubric for how to price a job?

Maggie:
Oh, I have a spreadsheet.

Rich:
Amazing yours Alice about that. You don’t have to necessarily

Maggie:
Yeah.

Rich:
Tell us what you want. Let’s tell us.

Maggie:
Well, I I want to make sure that I’m I’m charging proportionally for larger houses versus like the smaller houses. And so I’ve come up with. A a I’ve come up with rates like what I charge per hour. Plus like the rental fees. So staging typically works with like You have your staging fee and then you have your rental fee for the furniture. So. I have to decide you know. Usually more I like I get the furniture. I rent a Chronicle rent the furniture to people for about a month at a time. and that’s that’s a great upon rate like before I even step foot into the house and set a piece of furniture down and I figure out by walking through the space. How much time it I kind of estimated my head like how much I think how much time I think it’s gonna take me and Joe and that’s how I come up with the estimates based upon the numbers I plug into the spreadsheet and I’m most of the time I’m I’m sure you do this too. I totally underestimate how much time is gonna take. I think it’s only going to take me eight hours and it takes me 15. Yeah, you know what I mean? So I’m trying to get better about like, okay if I think it’s gonna take me eight hours. It’s probably gonna take me.

Rich:
12 right That’s yeah, I mean I do I do that myself and

Maggie:
That’s like my labor and Joe’s labor. So it’s like we’re not there for 12 hours a day, but it’s like 12 hours of Labor which is like six hours of my time six hours of Joe’s time. Yeah. In the same day.

Rich:
Yeah experience. I guess you’ve you figure out you know. I mean in one sense the nice thing is once you estimate a job. Yeah, then. If that’s if you’re saying okay, this is my contract price like

Maggie:
Yeah,

Rich:
Then you can take longer. It’s on you if you take longer,

Maggie:
Right,

Rich:
You know, right? It’s not like they’re gonna be charged more

Maggie:
Right no longer. No,

Rich:
So in essence. You know, I but that yeah, so that’s that’s gets into how you want. How you need to run a business. Yeah time is valuable and you did. Yeah, make sure to do this more fishing Lee but then charging fairly.

Maggie:
Yes.

Rich:
That’s yeah. I don’t know something you

Maggie:
Which is what

Rich:
I’m sure

Maggie:
Which is what comes with my experience. Right? So like the houses I was staging a couple years ago. Are probably half of what I charge now? Because of my experience and how much I would I charge back then versus what I charge now.

Rich:
What is the difference? I’m sure there’s many actually so talk to me about the difference between differences between your work your job and like an interior designer.

Maggie:
Okay,

Rich:
Because there’s yeah, I think there’s gonna be similarities and differences. in one sense like in other words, I presume that you have a bit of a there’s a bit of an interior design component here.

Maggie:
Yes,

Rich:
So principles from that. I’m not like I don’t know anything about interior design. Yeah, but that’s a that’s a layer of what the work you do, but it’s also very different and there’s probably more flexibility around things so

Maggie:
Sure.

Rich:
That’s something I’ve been curious about.

Maggie:
I want to make a distinction because I think it’s a very common misconception like the term and I’m sure you thought this too. the term interior designer is actually a qualification like a designation that you receive after. like college education and intense internship with another designer or architect a apprenticeship. That’s the word. I’m looking for Lord where you like you’re an apprentice to another designer or an architect and you receive like an actual. like license of design

Rich:
Well, so

Maggie:
I am

Rich:
How many people know that I

Maggie:
That’s why I’m bringing this up because I wanted to make that distinction because I am not an interior designer because I haven’t gone through that schooling or apprenticeship and I don’t have that designation. If you want somebody who is that person? Check out Lee Owens. She’s a local interior designer. She’s amazing and she’s opening up her own firm in the Schenectady area and I want to show her out because she’s just an all-around amazing person. We met Ed Pottery Barn like so many of my friends my local like

Rich:
Decor friends,

Maggie:
But she’s an actual designer and She’s amazing if you want to like I not to like plug my old podcast because I don’t I’m not even like on it anymore. But I did interview her my old podcast. We’re working on working lunch. Yeah. So and I wanted to make that distinction because I don’t want to take credit. I don’t want to be like credited for a A designation that I’m not

Rich:
Yeah, so

Maggie:
That’s

Rich:
That makes I mean sure why would you but who who knew? I don’t know. I don’t know how commonly known that is. Now that you say it that way. It’s like you don’t think about oh interior designer like

Maggie:
Yes.

Rich:
That’s you don’t think about that.

Maggie:
Yes,

Rich:
I don’t think about that on the level of architect. You know, I didn’t realize I had to go to school get a certification apprentice and learned that trade. Yeah, according to these principles so that I can open a firm.

Maggie:
Yeah, because and have a liner

Rich:
Around it. You

Maggie:
Have to understand the complexities of like Homes, if you are like removing walls and putting in structure structural designs, like a lot of people will hire a designer to help them with an addition on their house or rent a renovation and a designer needs to know. What a load-bearing wall is and how to like do that because they work in in partnership with their with the architect. So usually if you’re hiring a designer, you’re making a big change in the house. I think and most people think of designer and decorators synonymous synonymous word where it’s like I would probably categorize myself as a decorator.

Rich:
Okay?

Maggie:
Because I bring in Furniture. I’m not removing walls. I’m not adding

Rich:
Things

Maggie:
Like structurally to a home.

Rich:
So that’s that’s a good distinction for me but thinking about it because yes, I didn’t real I never thought about an interior designer when I when I say those words, I think about that person imagining in my head. I’m seeing someone who’s doing what you’re talking about decorating. Yes, they’re moving. They’re installing moving furniture. They’re like planning a space but I didn’t think that person was gonna be saying let’s take this wall out like that’s a whole other level of things. So so you’re saying a decorator. Yes would be a better word for

Maggie:
For what I do

Rich:
What you do? Yes and the kind of person I was imagining.

Maggie:
Yes.

Rich:
When a real interior designer is more of a more of an architect. Yeah of a space.

Maggie:
Yes, that’s yes.

Rich:
You learned me something today.

Maggie:
They’re not necessarily an architect. They they just they but I believe and please correct me if I’m wrong. I believe if you are going to be considered a designer interior designer, you have to study and do an apprenticeship with an architect. So you have that so it’s part of the designation. So you have the understanding of the structural components of building a house.

Rich:
Yeah, no makes no sense.

Maggie:
So

Rich:
So that’s great.

Maggie:
That’s not me.

Rich:
That’s an answer. That’s that’s a huge part of the answer. So okay put you in the category of decorator.

Maggie:
Yeah decorator or so and So the difference between staging what I do staging and decorating is decorating. I would like an interior decorator is somebody who does more permanent things like somebody who’s looking to refresh their space and maybe like repaint their walls and or rearrange their furniture or help with like the feng shui so to speak of their space. and staging Is more temporary so I come I be I really just come in decorate. For a month and then come back and empty the house. Yeah, because it’s just for a short period of time and what I do is to help house sell. And what’s really awesome is I’ve been told by other agents of houses. I’ve staged in fact. Oh my gosh. I don’t know if I’ve told you this but I recently just met someone who bought a house I staged did I tell you this?

Rich:
No.

Maggie:
So I it on the only reason I got to meet this person is because their agent is in the same firm as me at gabler Realty. So house I staged Joe and I staged it. I ended up crossing paths with this the person who bought this house. and it was at a like a gambler event and Gabler Realty is the company. I work for clarity. and like when I met her she’s like oh my gosh, you staged the house. I bought and I’m like what? She’s like, oh my God, I loved this and that and I wanted to this and she just like started just like gushing over. How the staging helped her want to buy the house and I was like just it just I don’t know that moment. It was just such a moment where I was like wow, like I freaking love what I do because it is just it was such a good feeling to hear. From the person who now lives in that house is saying like what I did to the space helped her fall in love with the house and then she’s asking me like, where did I get my chairs? Where did I get this? Where did I get that? And it was just it was just a really cool feeling and like this is why I love what I do.

Rich:
Yeah. Yeah, right on.

Maggie:
Yeah. Hmm

Rich:
Congrats,

Maggie:
Thanks. Yeah, it was a cool feeling.

Rich:
Do you ever find not gonna imagine that like homeowners, you know, they’re hiring you to did take care of business. Yeah, they don’t want to have to think about.

Maggie:
Yes the

Rich:
Whole or the beauty of it is like they don’t have to think about whether housing gonna look like

Maggie:
Right

Rich:
But do you have you ever found anyone who like has suggestions or wants to other than if they’re using their own Furniture,

Maggie:
Um,

Rich:
Like happens now or you know,

Maggie:
Because most of the time I

Rich:
Wouldn’t want it,

Maggie:
But I’m the agent it’s the listing agent who hires me. I’m rarely hired by the homeowner unless they’re my client unless I’m the one listing their home for sale. So I I have had my own clients whose house I’m selling where they still live in the home and Actually, I did I did stage a house recently for another agent and it was a a single guy who’s had four children like teenagers like ranging from like or like college age to like, I don’t know middle school and it was a really big house and I had to do like a hybrid version and I actually had to I so I staged his bedroom. And I was like listen. Take up like I can’t and like this, you know, you kind of get a feel for people’s personalities and what they’re like and like I felt like I could like bring them up to his bedroom and be like, okay take a picture of this bed. Like this is what I’ve done because like he’s living and sleeping in his bed. And like I don’t want him like sleeping on my pillows and my comforter and I don’t think he does either. Yeah, right and so I’m like, you know, I’m staging your bed right now and there’s like pillows and like like a bunch of stuff and like do me a favor take out your phone take a photo of the bed and then Like when you go to sleep tonight, you know, you’re gonna remove all these things and you’re gonna like put them away on the side over here. When you have a showing for your house take out your phone. Look at this photo and do exactly this.

Rich:
Wow,

Maggie:
Like put the pillows here put the blanket here put the you know, this is what you have to do and he’s like, oh, okay. Okay because it wasn’t just like, oh, I’m I made the bed and and walk away. Like if I do that on an empty house, I can trust that no one’s gonna mess around with it. But if somebody’s actually still using that bedroom and sleeping in that bed like and there’s a comforter and a blanket and throw pillows and regular pillows and all this othering that needs to happen. I want to I still wanted to look like the photos because right I have no control of that once I leave the house once and I close the door.

Rich:
That’s interesting Dynamic.

Maggie:
It is an interesting Dynamic.

Rich:
We’re truly collaborative.

Maggie:
Yeah. I don’t know if that answers your question or not. Yeah, I mean a lot of ways so.

Rich:
I think okay, sir interior designer great job guys way to get those certification.

Maggie:
Yes.

Rich:
Interior decorator.

Maggie:
Yeah,

Rich:
Totally different person and you’re more in that category, but the but a huge distinction is obviously that your stuff is you’re choosing. You know, it almost doesn’t matter what the homeowner thinks about the way it looks because you’re just trying to sell this. Yes. place and and then the things you’re doing are. They’re not permanent, obviously,

Maggie:
Right? So

Rich:
The choices are there’s just a lot more flexibility. I’m sure and an interior decorator would be someone who would I mean, I don’t know how much do do you just have you studied that? Person’s job at all. Like essentially what I did when I was at Pottery Barn. Okay, right.

Maggie:
My job at Pottery. Barn was actually called Design Studio specialist. That’s what they’re called at Pottery Barn, which is confusing because the word design is in it, but they don’t say you’re the Pottery Barn designers. They say you’re a design studio specialist. And what I did as a design studio specialist was help people decorate using Pottery Barn furniture.

Rich:
Cool. Well, yeah.

Maggie:
And yes, I made president’s Club.

Rich:
He’s hit again. I

Maggie:
Said and yes, I made president’s Club.

Rich:
What is what does that mean?

Maggie:
It’s just like you sell a certain you have like

Rich:
Is that another Pottery Barn? Yes word. Shut up Pottery Barn customer said the world. Okay, cool. Cool. Well, that’s that’s pretty insightful. Is there anything we didn’t touch on?

Maggie:
Alright, so I think that. the takeaways for staging is if you if you have a house to sell. then you don’t have to do it alone. You can you know, look for inspiration online. There’s lots of other staging companies who? Stage places where you can get inspiration from but don’t stage with crappy furniture. It’s better to put that stuff to the curb and get it out of the house. And if you don’t have access to a Stager or or like furniture that you could use temporarily. Do a virtual stage with the service like box brownie. or leave the house blank because there’s nothing worse than go having going into a house and it being like not what you expected for the buyer. So there’s nothing worse for a buyer to go into a house and have what their perception of the house is going to be and then the reality of what that house is going to be when they get there. So you want to make sure you get as close to that as possible good, you know, you don’t want it. They’re gonna have an expectation in their mind. Most buyers think look at photos me. Like wow, the house is amazing. I want to look at it and then they get there and then they’re like, oh it’s not as good as the photos. Yeah, and you don’t want that.

Rich:
Yeah, sure. and you know that I I guess I’m not surprised by the by. by your answer that’s better be blank than

Maggie:
Yeah,

Rich:
But like it’s yeah which seems counting intuitive exactly exactly because it’s like Coming. Yeah, right. It does. It seems counterintuitive because you want to say like I’m just being a perfectionist or you know, it’s better to look lived in or whatever. We you know, there’s all these reasons. Yeah excuses, but

Maggie:
Obviously hire me to Stage the house. That’s number one. Well,

Rich:
Yeah, I wouldn’t I mean, I personally I I that’s obviously I know that answer. Cervical. All right. Well if you’re looking for inspiration on how to Stage your home, you can check out Zillow Gone Wild. That is a something I recently discovered.

Maggie:
You recently discovered Zillow gone wild like 30 minutes ago.

Rich:
He was very shocked that I don’t follow.

Maggie:
Oh my gosh, it is amazing,

Rich:
But It’s it’s insightful.

Maggie:
So

Rich:
Check that out

Maggie:
Or somebody has specific staging questions or design questions or Decor questions. I should say.

Rich:
Yeah book a free consultation.

Maggie:
Like you can DM me my Instagram is Maggie from or you can just email House Coffee podcast at Gmail and we could talk about it here on the podcast if it’s a you know more specific question that yeah.

Rich:
Do you have free consultations?

Maggie:
On the phone on the phone

Rich:
Someone.

Maggie:
Yeah,

Rich:
We chat. Yeah. Yeah, I had

Maggie:
It on yesterday.

Rich:
But yeah,

Maggie:
But I don’t give someone I won’t give someone a price unless I see the house first.

Rich:
Yeah. Yeah, that’s that makes sense. Yeah, that’s fair. Um, yeah, I think that was all my questions and this is a good question points. That we had about that. So it’s cool here from you. You know, that’s a big part of your business. What what’s on the docket for next week?

Maggie:
We should talk about some coffee questions next week.

Rich:
Okay,

Maggie:
What do you think

Rich:
Maybe? maybe I’m also interested in having a conversation about like we’ve been talking about Thrifting

Maggie:
Yes,

Rich:
And how

Maggie:
Don’t get me going now Rich

Rich:
We’ve been talking about how thrifting is kind. I don’t say it’s coming. It’s a it’s making a comeback. I don’t think it’s ever gone anywhere, but I do think there’s like this movement.

Maggie:
Mm-hmm

Rich:
Out there. That’s like

Maggie:
Trendy.

Rich:
Let’s Thrift. Let’s repurpose. Let’s come up with cycle.

Maggie:
Yeah,

Rich:
Let’s Round them up. Shout out to the the Vintage Roundup.

Maggie:
Yeah,

Rich:
And then like even vintage and stuff and that’s you know, I’ve never considered myself super into vintage but I found you know redecorating story recently that like that was kind of what we leaned into a little bit and so all that kind of stuff like bringing you bring. Old things back to life and stuff like that versus buying new. and I mean I could even pertain to houses like like not as if fixer upper but like re choosing an old house and making it work and come back to life versus buying. something new and yeah and put together, you know, and there’s definitely different between investment property right

Maggie:
And

Rich:
Fixer upper and like an old house that just needs a new needs a new lease on life. So I think all those kinds of things. Would be cool to chat about

Maggie:
Yeah

Rich:
In line with the recent experience. You had that we can

Maggie:
Yeah, I would love to continue this conversation. I could talk about this for hours and hours

Rich:
Sick.

Maggie:
So I hope I hope we get more questions like home related and staging related and thrifting related so that we can talk about them next week.

Rich:
Yeah. Yeah, it is with those thoughts if you got any questions, etc,

Maggie:
Etc. Yeah,

Rich:
You know the channels but

Maggie:
Hmm. How’s that at gmail?

Rich:
Yeah, totally and Instagram DMS.

Maggie:
Yep.

Rich:
Alright y’all thanks for tuning in this week good hearing from you. Here you talking to you hear from me? Yeah,

Maggie:
We

Rich:
Did get an email recently as it was good to hear.

Maggie:
Yeah,

Rich:
Kurt.

Maggie:
Hey.

Rich:
Among others, so all right.

Maggie:
Here