10: Coffee Shops are Temporary, Hospitality is Forever

Intro:
Hey, you’re drinking house coffee – unfiltered conversations brewed at the intersection of real estate life and coffee shop service. We’re Maggie and Rich – local business owners and friends sharing stories and welcoming you to pull up a chair with us. The door’s always open. Let us pour you a cup.

Rich:
Hey, what’s up, guys? This is TJ from my home studio at 12 am. Is finished mixing this next episode. It’s a really good one, but there was a lot of bleed in the recording so little heads up on that there might be some wonky stuff here there, but you know what? Four star producer. Alright. Anyway, enjoy Okay. Wow. Yeah, that’s a hot day. That was a hot thing.

Maggie:
Welcome back coffee

Rich:
For that exclusive access. All right, that’s a good reporting conversation. I’m happy that we got to chat about that I too and if we start this episode from right before that then everyone’s gonna be like, oh no what I miss. Yeah, how to be there? Yeah, you did have to be here. Well, hey today in the studio. We have our good friend TJ McMaster

Maggie:
TJ’s in the house.

Rich:
He is a

Maggie:
We’ll just call my producer.

Rich:
He’s our producer

Maggie:
Audio engineer.

Rich:
Yeah, audio engineer

Maggie:
Definitely earned that title.

Rich:
He’s here engineering his own audio. Wow for today’s episode. He’s on a separate recording. He’s got a he’s got his own handheld microphone not on purpose though. He just know just have a clip for that and then immature and

Maggie:
We’re not gonna hold it against you

Rich:
His own computer running grabbing that audio so Shout out TJ. Thanks for being here. Hear it hissing in the background. Oh because I don’t have like a nice fan. Your mic is more sensitive than our so maybe but probably has it. It’s a condenser probably that empowered.

Maggie:
So what are we talking about today

Rich:
Today? We’re gonna actually want to just hear from TJ a little bit because we’ve introduced ourselves as like, you know, what we do in life and when our creative Pursuits, I don’t even we know TJ’s got a lot going on in his life. He’s got a band one just one band at no. You’re more than one bad. Yeah. Well, it’s it’s not my band per se. So there’s there’s the one that’s like my band. Like I started it. I manage it I market for it. I write for It produced for it playing it. What’s called Apollo Apollo. Yeah aplo. We spelled it differently than the traditional spelling of Apollo like the Greek god god of music because it’s more marketable that way um It’s it’s like it’s like when you condense like a word for like a license plate, you know, like like if you look up aplo like unlike Spotify or something like we’re on the top of the list nice, you know, but if you look like if you look up Apollo like the regular spelling you have like all these big names, you know. So you heard it here first API? Hello. And you have a second. Yeah. Yeah, um another band that I I play in they’re called Old Country Landscaping. Okay. I have seen it on Instagram. Oh, really? Yeah, probably something you shared. Yeah. That’s those guys are great. Um genre unfamiliar. I I could tell you Apollo. We call it like Indie Soul Funk because it fuses like a lot of like modern day. Indie pop rock elements with like 70s 80s Soul Funk City pop jazz fusion. Holy. Yeah, I love all but yeah. But no Old Country Landscaping. It has like elements of jazz and like folk I guess I we just make music man. I don’t know are they both groups from your college? Yes, like all music. So you’re all music people. Yes on both sides. Wow, that’s cool. So it’s Destined to sound good either way. Yeah. Yeah. It’s one sweet. What else you got going on? You’re turning your engineering into a Business. Yes, I am going to talk LLCs soon. Oh, I just found that text message. You asked me. Oh, yeah, what talk to you talk through LLC. Yeah formation. And I please forgot that’s why oh, we can have like an actual conversation on that over pour overs or something. I’m just the resident LLC Guru. Yeah,

Maggie:
It’s

Rich:
Up. Right got you covered. Oh, yeah all the things you don’t need to pay for. Yeah. All right. Yeah, I know

Maggie:
For sure do

Rich:
It for a very inexpensively. Yeah, the government sucks to work with right

Maggie:
No

Rich:
Hams. They’re actually easy ones on this.

Maggie:
Yeah, the government’s actually

Rich:
It’s just coffee a lot of stuff. I’ve been struggling with some copyright stuff lately that I have to upload. Okay. Well that’s a different issue actually for that Beast, um trademark what not all that, but Yeah, so I I do have plans to start my own business Someday. I’m starting small,

Maggie:
But you’re in good company.

Rich:
Oh. It’s nice having supportive people to sort of build like the business around and like sort of learn from I I feel like the younger brother, you know, like my my older brother like biological older brother, you know, I it’s like it was nice to like grow up with him see his mistakes and be like, I’m not gonna do that, you know. Yeah, I I sort of feel that way with you sometimes you know, you know sharks. Yeah what people won’t know is that TJ’s older brother was a freshman when I was a senior in high school. Yes. Um, so rich is literally spread.

Maggie:
We should also point out that TJ works at story

Rich:
Too. Sure. Does that yes, yes, bro. Is a residents slow Slinger residence Bros linger,

Maggie:
What does that even mean?

Rich:
Espresso? Oh, yeah, you know here’s your coffee man drink down the bar.

Maggie:
But what spro is just for espresso?

Rich:
Yeah. Yeah, like not my first rodeo.

Maggie:
Got it.

Rich:
Yeah.

Maggie:
You’re you’re talking to like a non coffee shop Guru and maybe some of our listeners might not know what that is.

Rich:
Well listeners might not but I figured all people you’ve been around the shop long enough. I got Sparrow written on enough stuff. Yeah.

Maggie:
Well, I was never noticed it once

Rich:
Bro and tonic. Yes, bro, and tonic was a classic.

Maggie:
Never ordered

Rich:
What else never had no cream sproda. Oh, yeah, the spretta the vanilla creams Broda for soda. But as well as soda there is the espresso. Everyone’s all soprada the yes folk, kombucha with an espresso shot in it. Yes, espresso. Yeah,

Maggie:
Didn’t that recently come off the menu

Rich:
Sure did yeah, so it is protonic and vanilla cream sproota. Nobody’s gonna see the word Sprouse story anymore except except where we just it’s a inserted in conversation. Yeah. But not because it’s a bad word just because we did revamp our menu.

Maggie:
Yeah.

Rich:
More profitable.

Maggie:
So what is it that? How did we get to TJ being in on this conversation? Like what was it about? We because today what we’re talking about

Rich:
Conversation.

Maggie:
Yeah today, we’re talking about principles of hospitality. So it would be interesting maybe to rehash for like 30 seconds like how TJ became a part of that conversation, right?

Rich:
Sure. Do you recollection? We probably all have a different idea of how that came. Yeah. I mean like how behind the scenes are we talking.

Maggie:
Well, I mean we were we were having a planning meeting. All right?

Rich:
Yeah.

Maggie:
And I think it was we was just more or less just the planning meeting for like Logistics and then we got talking about like five star experiences because I think that was the episode we were going to be recording which is was like two episodes ago.

Rich:
Yeah,

Maggie:
And we started talking about hospitality and TJ seemed to have a lot of opinions and a lot of like rant insight and you went a rant about it. So We wanted to talk about that today.

Rich:
Yeah. Well, I knew that TJ would have things to say because I work with him and he’s been in the hospitality industry. I mean the food service, but they’re so closely linked. That they might be one in the same. He’s been in food service for a long time. when I you were working for you were working the farmers market when I first met you right when you first got hired a story you were still. Working a farmers market on the weekends. Yeah, had you done Food Service before that? No, had you done hospitality? Service before that. I mean you were kind of young you’re not. Yes, so I my first job ever. I was a camp counselor at this theater campus Shenandoah High School. And after that ended I always during the school year and I need to know another job. And I was talking to my dear friend Joey Titus. And I was like yo. Well, sorry. Well, he was telling me about this like job at the farmers market. I think it’s like leave it or something and he know I needed a job so he offered it to me. So I started working for them. It was a I think they’re Jewish Bakery. They’re called our daily bread. Got out they’re really great. I love their stuff just sort of ubiquitous in the capital region at various coffee shops and Markets because they do a wholesale. Yeah, and obviously the Farmers Market. They got a good reputation. Yeah. Yeah, they’re really really tasty that the hamantashion is just dirty here first. Yeah, the croissants you could put a nice egg sandwich on there. It’s great. But yeah, so after that I needed more hours because I needed more money because I got a car and I was like I I came over to the coffee shop. And I knew I knew not to ask you if you were hiring that I train him. Well, he were like don’t never ask if I’m hiring. No one should ever ask if I’m hiring. So I was like got it. Why not because we were never hiring. I was especially not hiring off the spot. Yeah. So I I genuinely not was not planning on being hired by you. So I just 2019. Yes. This was pre-covid. This was Our first year of business. Yeah. No it was 2020. Yeah, it was post covid.

Maggie:
Right. No, I think I remember TJ before covid.

Rich:
Were you there before Calvin? No, it was definitely after Colby. Yeah, you were coming around story forever. Yeah, and that’s how I got into know you right but you ask because I only going into cool that I only had I had three staff you weren’t one of them and we let them all go at the time. Yeah, and then when they came back the shop got super busy over the summer because like after the Brunt of the first wave. Everyone was like Alan Force, especially in the summer, you know, people are just out and around. And storied was going crazy and I had my staff back through the summer, but then by Fall, I’m not sure what happened. It was like it was I guess it was maybe busy in the fall too. Yeah. Well, you know saying the most covid like everyone was looking to do literally anything they could yeah, you know, right I’m just saying how it was that you showed up on my doorstep. Yeah, and I think I had literally just been talking to Christine. I was like what on Earth are we gonna do? We’re like getting busy whatever and then I was just I had been kind of thinking about that for a while because while I don’t hire I do get interest from people and so um, I don’t know if you had asked in the past. No, because I I that was no no word. I don’t know. Well anyway, so I just remember one one evening. You came. in the shop, and I think I had just been talking to Christine and I literally was like You look for a job. Yeah, I said it but what happened was I walked in and I needed a job and I was thinking of being inspired across the street actually and I was I was looking for anything at that point. I was like, I just need money. So I was like, yo, do you know if she’s like hiring across the street? And you’re all like I don’t know but we are and

Maggie:
The right place at the right time.

Rich:
He’s literally the right place at the right time. It was reverse psychology. Yeah, that’s how good yeah, yeah manipulation for the win and here he is still. With us. Yeah, we’re always running I guess at this point.

Maggie:
Yeah.

Rich:
Right, I did Kristen Kristen retire just before you yeah, like like me or weeks before me. Yeah, like one of you man hiring spree. Yeah. Wow, um Kristen still technically works for us. In fact, she just covered you and you were away last weekend and although she’s she’s currently not working like a lot with us just because of our unavailable like we don’t have a lot hours available. TJ’s back for the summer. He’s got given him the bare minimum right now. He’s covering some

Maggie:
Midday

Rich:
Some morning early afternoon shifts just that food period yeah. Um, yeah, so that’s that’s how that went down. And then I just been super cool to watch you grow as a as a person off to college and but even a story like Growing in your especially coffee. Like I’m not sure there’s anyone more passionate about coffee and pour-overs at story then yeah, I the chemistry is just so fascinating to me and Creating something. Yeah is just so wonderful. Like each latte is like my baby. Yeah, and I need to cherish it. You know, I think such you’re one of the first to really get into the latte are yeah. Yeah, I because I I like know a lot they are and can kind of do different like I can yeah pretty basic stuff. But TJ was the one to really kind of invest some time and and learning their process. Well, I I’m naturally a very artistic person. I I really resonate with like the whole coffee people thing like you had the coffee people Max and the shop for a bit or is it? Yeah shout out. Um, it was it basically says like, People who make coffee are just so naturally artistic, you know, like I I’ve rarely personally even me like I go into coffee shops all the time. I’ve rarely met a barista that doesn’t do much in like the Arts. You know, I Visual Arts music film photography like you name it like they do something, you know, or at the very least they care about it and in their invested in it, you know, it’s the people that consume it too. Like I just the other day. I’m at some really rad people at the shop and was just talking to them about my music about their photography and there are and everything like that, you know. But yeah, and it’s another thing is my work ethic. My my dad would always tell me I don’t care what you do with your life. You should just be good at it. Yeah be good at what you do. So I was like, I’m a barista now, I’m gonna be the best flipping Barista on the Ave. Um, so I want to get in the latte area making good pour over cool.

Maggie:
Cool

Rich:
There you have it. You

Maggie:
Heard it here first as

Rich:
There was a rough period there where Maggie was. An Aragon on you a bit at the shop. I felt

Maggie:
I was wondering if you’re gonna bring that up

Rich:
Almost that fell back because it was kind of funny but It was all in good fun.

Maggie:
It was all good fun.

Rich:
But I think you took it that way. I cried a little bit. Is this a time now that we’re all here?

Maggie:
No, you can like

Rich:
Then you need to bring it out there. Yeah, so no.

Maggie:
Yeah to be honest. Like I didn’t realize how young you were. Oh,

Rich:
Really? Yeah.

Maggie:
I really didn’t I I really I was and then like once I realized I was like, oh man, I’m really giving him a hard time. I should like step back a little bit and not and not like be so I’m not mean but I just feel like it was more it would it really wasn’t good fun like and that usually, you know, how like for me if if I’m like poking fun at you then like I feel like I have a like more of our friendship with you like then like a stranger. No and I felt like yeah that Rapport I get was was instantly made. Oh, yeah, we first met.

Rich:
Yeah that that that’s how it was growing

Maggie:
Because of how friendly you were.

Rich:
Yeah, and I I was the youngest in my family. Everyone would always make me the butt under the jokes. Like I don’t really take stuff. You know, like I it’s all just humor to me.

Maggie:
Yeah for contacts. I was just like I just blame TJ.

Rich:
Yeah,

Maggie:
Like play anything wrong at the shop. I would like, it’s TJ’s following.

Rich:
Well, and now here we all are and I’ve been messed a drink up since

Maggie:
He

Rich:
Oh, man. I served Maggie a tuna sandwich instead of chicken one time but How relaxed I’m not sure I pulled a TJ.

Maggie:
Yeah, I was like, oh did TJ make this

Rich:
All right. So here’s a question. Yeah now without defining principles of Oz fatalities. principles of hospitality which I want to do. First I want to ask you this question. How so you talked about your work ethic? And you talked about what you’re saying kind of? Why what got you invested in your job as story. What got you? to go deeper with your your just clinical job as a as a barista right A lot of people can look at that as a pretty basic pretty easy. Thing to to do to like get a little money, but but then I’m more like how can Baristas actually level up and consider themselves professional and what makes professional coffee preparation like a thing and that’s really where story wants to live. So yeah, there’s different ways to approach that whole Barista career. conversation so That’s a little primer for you. Now. The question is how how much would you say that your concept of principles of hospitality? factored into or factored into How seriously you take your job? Well, that’s something I developed. Well, that was that story. Okay, I I sort of I I had opinions on like how to like treat human beings, I guess like and I also had opinions on how like a business should function like and I also had opinions on how like a business should function. you know I have never Ever been one for like a corporate environment where I’m not human like I’m a cog in the machine and the consumers at said business are not cogs either. You know a lot of businesses. function and Thrive based off of these sole purpose of making the business Thrive, but like I want to create a human experience like something enjoyable like a craft. You know. so I I didn’t really know how to put that into words until like you had some like training done with me like until we had some like philosophic Chats on like why we do what we do I learned Part of what? I do, you know from like cat and Cloud when you had me listen to a couple episodes on stuff like that, you know, and I just I love people I love talking to people like the smile on my face that I have while I’m at the chat the the shop. is natural You know, yeah, it’s hard sometimes but like ultimately. I I just want people to enjoy something because life can suck sometimes so if I can be the the thing in that day to make it a little better. I’ve made an impact. And that’s something I want to do for the rest of my life. Word

Maggie:
That explains a lot. Yeah, there’s no TJ’s to understand. I just

Rich:
Said I just care about the human race, you know? Yeah, like I’m not gonna be a firefighter. I’m not gonna be the president but like if I can make someone a good cup of coffee and make them a good song that they are like yo, I like the way this sounds I’m gonna listen to in the car on the way to work. That’s dope. You know, I’m cool with that. That’s what I do. Did honestly like how often is a Dave ruined by bad cup of coffee? You know, this is why often people take that one granted and that’s my big so by

Maggie:
About a one-star experience.

Rich:
You should

Maggie:
Not that story

Rich:
One of I had like a two star experience in my own kitchen this morning. Okay, your own kitchen were you that I I need to learn better how to love myself and treat my own soul. Like like I treat other people’s but I I had a little bit of coffee left that was ground a few days ago because it was just like at the bottom of the grinder and I was like, I I need my coffee like I need my pour over I’m gonna use it now in my coffee just tastes like old coffee this morning. no,

Maggie:
At least you don’t do what I do and like pour a cup of coffee and then like if you don’t finish it use it as a nice coffee the next day.

Rich:
I’m I’m not gonna say what I was gonna say unfiltered, but it’s shouting on a business and I don’t want to like,

Maggie:
Oh no, we don’t name names here. Yeah.

Rich:
I know. Yeah. Well as you do it’s a certain. Conglomerate. Oh local coffee Source okay that makes their iced coffee in that way. Okay. Okay. We do have to say we do have to be careful. Do we have to be careful? See this is the worshiper before we unfilter these things.

Maggie:
I definitely don’t want to like Talk poorly about other businesses. No.

Rich:
Yeah.

Maggie:
I’m cool shouting people out when they were when they do something. This is amazing.

Rich:
You know, what that’s adding up. This is a corporation true wisdom right there.

Maggie:
Yeah. Yeah. We don’t want it. We don’t want to be sued for defamation. Okay,

Rich:
And

Maggie:
Then we’ll really have to blame you.

Rich:
Yeah. True and however you TJ. You caused us a multi-million dollar loss. only Survive by tax evasion

Maggie:
Exactly But yeah,

Rich:
Go back.

Maggie:
So what are what are some of these principles like because

Rich:
Yes,

Maggie:
Someone listening may not necessarily be in a coffee industry. They might be in a different creative field. So

Rich:
Right

Maggie:
How really like real estate

Rich:
Staging

Maggie:
Or I mean all sorts of things.

Rich:
Oh, yeah

Maggie:
Entrepreneur. What are these? What are some key factors that we can Take away from that can be applied. towards these principles of hospitality like what is like One of the number one things as a creative person or entrepreneur. That somebody should. pursue

Rich:
Well, if that gives any thoughts you can answer that. But I want to make it even more. I don’t know if I want to make it more specific or general. in that like what are the so I was gonna say we all what’s a key takeaway all have something. I don’t know where to takeaways yet as I’m saying. I think we’re all at a place where we all have different thoughts about what what this is what this is the question on table for me right now. What are the principles of hospitality? They’re gonna be kind of specific to our industry, but they’re also going to be somewhat Universal I think and that’s why I’m interested in this question personally. And I think I’m interested in teachers take because we share a workspace. Yeah and a workplace and a culture and like we share a lot of common interests and common influences in coffee. We both have experience in music. You’re a lot more in that right now than I am. I haven’t been in a long time. You got your take from. your experience with all kinds of different people in the in

Maggie:
The

Rich:
I don’t know if you call this apply chain or value chain, like I don’t know what word to use for that

Maggie:
Referral sources.

Rich:
What I mean is I said in the coffee supply chain or the value chain you have like you have you have Farmers you have producers importers, you know buries roasters. Business owners like there’s just all these different people in this chain that creates like it experience. I don’t know

Maggie:
All that home inspectors appraisals.

Rich:
Yeah, exactly

Maggie:
Lenders contractors.

Rich:
Is there a name for is it just about is that a value chain? Is that like a blanket term for something like that?

Maggie:
I don’t know. That’s a good question. You know, you just say like I I call them referral partners because they’re people that I refer business to and they refer business to me, but

Rich:
Okay, we don’t have to dig in that the point is like for all those kinds of people in your industry that you deal with and for all the kinds of people in music that you deal with like everywhere you go. There’s there’s gonna be the opportunity for someone to apply and employ some principles of hospitality like good. When we got at some of that in the five star experience conversations, I’m not rehashing that I’m trying to say, what are those things? What are those characteristics? Maybe maybe I did try to get it that in that conversation. I just don’t know if we ever got there. So if I am rehashing I don’t think that’s fine. But that’s what I’m saying right now is like what are the principles of hospitality that universally we all recognize and we all expect. You’re fight your ropes course experience that you were talking about. You said you guys story.

Maggie:
Yep

Rich:
About something. So so hit us with those stories.

Maggie:
Okay, so great segue recently. I had an experience with a contractor and I was on the buying side of purchasing a house for with one of my clients. and there was something there was a defect in something in the house and we needed to get quote for this defect. and I I knew a family business who give a quote for this and I reached out to the person because I’m friends with them. I said, how much is it going to cost to get a quote for this? Just for your time because you know contractors they’re just running around giving quotes all the time and not doing work and they’re not getting business. They’re just wasting their time. So I set the expectation with my clients that if you’re going to get a quote for A roof a foundation a furnace a faucet whatever it is, you’re gonna pay that contractor for their time and their estimate because that’s just you just have to do that. So was the cost for this, you know assessment. They text me back and say x amount. Cool. I passed that information on to my client. I say it’s gonna cost you I’m using random numbers and I’m not sharing the type of businesses because I don’t want to like put anybody down.

Rich:
It’s all about the principles

Maggie:
Totally. For arguments sake let’s say the we’re going to charge you $100 for this estimate. I text that information to my client and they say Okay, our our person can can do it for that much too. We’ll just go with your recommendation and mind you I knew that this Quote, I knew they were gonna get the job. I try very hard to ask. Shoot that’s my alarm on

Rich:
My face. boss unfiltered conversation it’s funny because her phone is also the video source for our episodes All right. You were saying you try very hard to

Maggie:
Try really hard to. match people with contractors that I know the contractors gonna get the job. I don’t want to waste anybody’s time. We all are here to run our business and make money. So I knew that this contractor would get the job if we got the quote if we went forward. That being said the person got back to me. and again the family business said oh The boss said that because this house is like kind of far away. We’re adding an extra. We’ll call it a hundred bucks to the estimate for the distance. And so I replied and said I’ve already given my client what the original quote of a hundred dollars that you’re they’re gonna you know be charged you want me to go back to my client. Tell them. No, I’m sorry. Now it’s gonna be two hundred dollars for this estimate. There’s no way I’m doing that. so and this is where I feel like the principles of hospitality apply. It’s because

Rich:
I’m trying to ask myself if where are we going who’s got the process? Who’s who’s hospitable this

Maggie:
Right?

Rich:
So what hanger

Maggie:
It the point is if they got the job. Now my client won’t be able to trust that their original quote is going to be what it is because then they’re like, well you first quoted me a hundred bucks for this estimate, but then you quoted me 200 bucks. So if you quote me $3,000 to replace this thing. What is it going to be when you actually replace it? Are you going to make it no $4,000. You can’t trust them at their word if they can’t even do that. So what what I did in that situation was I was actually the contract I said look, Charge them 100 bucks like you said. If you get the job you get the job and it was worth that if you don’t get the job, I’ll venmo use a difference because I’m not going to these clients of mine and changing the price on them and making them pay more for an estimate that they’ve already budgeted in their head for. So I’ll meet you at the house. We’ll do this if you get the job great, if you don’t get the job, I’ll pay you the difference and they agreed and they got the job and it worked out and nobody had to like pay extra and I didn’t even want to bring that to my client. I didn’t even want to tell them. Oh, by the way, now, it’s this Mount I didn’t even tell them that I promised to pay the difference because it didn’t matter.

Rich:
Yeah.

Maggie:
I didn’t I wanted to kind of Shield them from that because they were just worried about getting this.

Rich:
Yeah,

Maggie:
Big thing fixed in the house and the contractor came gave a quote for the thing and we got an estimate from them and we use that to reduce the price on the house because it was a major defect and then after the closing my clients got money back for this thing and they were able to pay this contractor to do the work. So everybody won. It was a win win situation, but the point is like If you give somebody a quote are you you factor in what do you think is going to? Cost don’t change it after you’ve given that information because it’s very hard to go back because I don’t think the customer will. Trust you.

Rich:
Yeah from

Maggie:
There going forward.

Rich:
Okay, we have to move your thoughts. We have to mine this actually for the principles because I’m actually not sure who where the hospitality comes in was it you? being what was the contractor being inhospitable? to Up that quote were they being hospitable in? Agreeing to you say into agreeing your to your terms.

Maggie:
I think at first they were being inhospitable because they were thinking about the short-term. They were thinking Oh, we only service this area. Yeah,

Rich:
So

Maggie:
We gave you a price for the quote. We didn’t realize that this this was going to be a 45 minute drive away. So we’re gonna add on to this quote. They were thinking short-term and that’s my point. Like you can’t think short term with with business. You have to think in the long run because If they did that they could have lost a customer. They could have been like fine. My clients could have been like fine. We’ll pay you the $200 for the quote even though you told us it was going to be a hundred dollars, but we’re not going to hire you to do the job in that moment. That contractor could have lost. That like he was a huge opportunity cost. But now instead they could have looked at it like okay, we’ll eat that extra hundred bucks. We’ll come give great service to replace this thing and Not only that we will we’ll put our you know, we’ll give them great service. Hopefully they’ll hire us. And then we can continue to service this. Equipment that we’re installing. Yeah, you know. But I think if you just if you’re just thinking short-term like oh I need to get more money for the gas. I’m spending to go to your house to get to the get the quote. I think that’s very limiting instead. They should have thought bigger picture.

Rich:
Yes,

Maggie:
I don’t know that’s that’s my little rant.

Rich:
No definitely. Yeah, I’m actually really thinking through that one not to play Devil’s Advocate.

Maggie:
Please unfiltered.

Rich:
No, I because there’s a there’s a lot of angles to that one in once but this is how I think though I’m like, how do you can kind of see that from all sides, you know from to to a degree. This is always the question. This is why this is a fashion question for me principles of hospitalities. It’s like how far do you go? How far can you go and I’m just gonna I’m just gonna put it out there because I think for me this is probably the number one like thing that gets to people. I think we kind of said this before but it’s I’ve been reflecting on it and thinking about this. It’s it’s exceeding expectations. It’s when you go out of your way, it’s when you kind of eat it sometimes to make someone else have like an experience on another level. I think that is what hospitality. That’s when someone really feels like you’ve been hospitable. It’s when you when they might worry that you’ve been put out, but you said never mind that like I’m taking care of you that is Principal of hospitality for me somewhere at around the core of what that means. It’s it’s that kind of idea and so in that case a contractor who says Okay, I Trust Maggie’s judgment here. I’m going to Honor what I said before it seems like a pretty good pretty sure deal and then like they come out and then in that in incoming out, they’re not like bitter that they didn’t get their extra money. They’re nice pleasant. They answer all the questions. They’re super helpful and then just like that. They go out of their way. That’s really it like you go out of your way for someone else. That’s Hospitality to me. principle number one you’re you’re always going to be going out of your way on behalf of someone else when you’re when you’re really like laying a good framework groundwork for for a hospital experience and I have some so I I would go from there and run with that as far as You know how you can set up a service experience? that reflects that so that’s kind of like how I maybe Define the whole concept of hospitality is like Going out of your way. I’m writing this down as I say going I have your way. on behalf of someone else and and if that’s true and I think it is then you can actually just ask yourself. Okay, how do I do that at home? Is that how it works in my home with someone’s over? Is that how it works when I met? You know and I’m and you can give me a hospitable as a customer if you think about it. If this is true, you can apply this on the other side of the bar, you know, so, okay. I don’t want to get into all that because I got a lot to say Obviously. So how does that hit you guys am I saying is that

Maggie:
Yeah, that’s my point where you summarize my point.

Rich:
Okay, and that’s what I was trying to kind of do is like capture what you were saying because I wasn’t totally sure I think you were being hospitable to your client to your your buyers and you were being Smart to the the other contractor. I’m not sure that contractors were. Did when they came out were they like what was the was it a good circuit service experience? Were you there?

Maggie:
I was there. Yep. I was there it was a great experience and and I even made sure that they got paid that day of the quote that they said like we were getting ready to go. I remember like we were like wrapping things up. They were like, okay, I’ll give you the quote and then I even I even we were just kind of staying there and I’m like, okay. So do you want to do cash or chat? I just sort of like brought it up because I just you know, you know Moment Like again and my clients they didn’t know about the discussion about

Rich:
Right

Maggie:
Like for Or being more money or whatever. but at the end of the day, I just think it’s bit like your customer. I feel like shouldn’t should be shielded from from those discussions. Like there’s definitely certain things that like I choose to tell my clients. In the middle of a transaction because I don’t want to heighten it.

Rich:
Yeah, you

Maggie:
Know,

Rich:
But

Maggie:
Somebody is different than your average

Rich:
True. Well, I mean, but it’s a business and that’s what I was gonna say is to so, how do you decide how do you know how far to go with that? How does someone else know how far to go with that? And I think we don’t have the answers of those questions actually spoiler alert.

Maggie:
Well, I I’m in my experience. I used to have very knee-jerk reactions and like as soon as I would get information about something immediately, I would text my client about it and then that would kind of inflame it.

Rich:
Yeah, and

Maggie:
So now what I’ve learned over my years of experience is when I receive negative information or when I get piece of bad news I kind of wait a little bit and I digest it before passing that news on to my client because it is really about all about how you frame it.

Rich:
Yes, smart leadership. Well, you have to do that problem solving and

Maggie:
Yeah, you gotta go with it with them with the

Rich:
Solution if they’re hiring you as the expert to do all of this work is like, you know, like jobs are just like work. you know like like anything in this world, like if you’re going to a coffee shop, you know, you’re essentially hiring someone for like eight to nine bucks to make you like this Gourmet latte that someone’s developed a craft for over the next like over the past couple years, you know, like They’re doing the leg work for you. In your business you’re doing a legwork. Therefore you save them the headaches you the problem solving, you know, and if if you immediately tell them like everything that’s going wrong. That’s gonna be a headache for them

Maggie:
Right?

Rich:
Therefore. You’re not doing your job,

Maggie:
Right? That’s good point. Yeah. Yeah, my job essentially is to provide solutions for people. Also. I just learned this really great quote in a continuing ed class that I just took and I kind of want to share it along and maybe it could help you in your businesses in the future and that is Be the source, not the resource. And I am I am definitely. Oh and I can remind you at later be the source not the resource. And basically this means Point people to the answers. Don’t necessarily give them a concrete answer and that’s what I feel like my job. As a real estate agent is to point them to the answers and resources. They can have because some of those things. I don’t I shouldn’t be giving people definite answers on like for example, is this a safe neighborhood?

Rich:
Oh,

Maggie:
I can’t say yes or no to that that could be a violation. So I would have to point them. Well, here’s a place where you could look that up. Why don’t you contact the local police department and ask about them? Why don’t you talk to the you know, look up the newspaper. Look there are ways that you can answer those questions for somebody without being the source.

Rich:
Yeah

Maggie:
Of information.

Rich:
But when you can be the source,

Maggie:
Yeah. Wait, did I say that right be the Be the resource not the source.

Rich:
Okay, he said that backwards and I liked it the other way.

Maggie:
Okay the other way

Rich:
But I guess everything as long as everything. I just said start resting long as you’re not gonna incur liability then

Maggie:
Right

Rich:
The source

Maggie:
Be a resource for someone don’t be the source of the information. So sorry, I actually went

Rich:
With that. I was like no, I like that.

Maggie:
I

Rich:
Like this one liners. I also have some one. I guess. I’ve been writing down

Maggie:
Dang it. That’s that’s my ADHD brain like speaking before my brain or all my friends. Yeah.

Rich:
That’s so funny though because I like it both ways. Perfect. Well, I can apply it both ways. That’s good. You guys story breath dude. Yeah, I I got loads of those. All right. Well I got time for one. Okay, if you guys wanted two part this we can I I am on a little time crunch today, but that’s

Maggie:
How many more minutes do we have left?

Rich:
I can go for another. 15 okay and good. I don’t know what length we’re at right now. I mean

Maggie:
We’re at we’re at like around 40

Rich:
Anyone with us at this point just along for the ride, so So, all right. It’s fancy we get Okay, so I also work at this place called boundless Adventures that when I’m at school. And they’re great there. Love them dearly great

Maggie:
People. There are rock climbing place.

Rich:
Yeah. Yeah. It’s like it’s like a it’s like a ropes climbing place like courses when I I wear like this harness and everything and I’m a monitor essentially that’s like a lifeguard in the trees cool. Like if someone like Falls and they can’t get themself up like I run up there

Maggie:
On belay.

Rich:
I’m everything. Yeah, and and I absolutely believe them down, but That’s that’s a whole different world for me. I’m not gonna lie. I it’s like sort of unappealing for me. Like I don’t really do much climbing. That’s like not my forte. But like what’s kept me? There is the people. You know and like I I love my management they’re good people. Like I said, I’m not really one for corporations. So like if I like the people at a job I’m staying like I’m lucky, you know, especially because I get paid pretty well there. But speaking of getting paid well rarely do we make tips? It’s not really like a tip job, but I recall one time I got like a hundred dollar tip from this mother. Because I was on this course guiding her and her daughter. Her daughter was like seven that’s like the youngest age that we could have had at a time on a course. I took her on the easiest course there is in the entire place. And we were on there for two hours because her daughter the seven year old is having like a panic attack the entire time. the mom told me that. She brought her daughter here to help her overcome her fear of like heights and like like the climbing and like the zip lines and everything like that. and that is difficult because children are fragile, you know, they they have these fears like fear of the dark spiders whatnot and everything, you know, like and I was up there. With the daughter, like I said for two hours, it’s a really short course and and she was like crying almost the entire time. Like yeah, I would have to coax her to get on to an element though. There’s like the obstacles we call them elements there. I would have to coax here onto an element and sort of guide her on how to do it and how to do it in a way that’s going to save her. The least like stress like oh like like this is how you climb this without it like wobbling all over the place. So you’re not gonna freak out, you know, I I was madly afraid of heights before this job. So I had to figure that stuff out myself, too. Yes,

Maggie:
So you had a little bit of empathy for

Rich:
Yeah. Yeah, and and she would be like sobbing like from the beginning of the element. Well, like like before she even got in the helmet like like the first steps like she would like try and step on it for like 10 or 20 minutes and then she would finally get on it and like crawl very slowly and like until like around like the 50. Yeah, like the 50% Mark

Maggie:
No one was like forcing her to do this something that she was like it was all encouragement, you

Rich:
Know, and every time I asked her if she wanted to keep going she was like, yeah, I want to do this. I’m just terrified and I was like, that’s great. You know, you’re doing a good thing for yourself, you know, like you’re overcoming your fear, that’s crazy. And I personally like I I wasn’t supposed to be up there for that long like my my team members and my management was like, you know, like you got to get down like we need you to do something else and then the mom Like like yelled at them a top from the trees and because she was up there climbing with us and she was like, I’ll pay whatever money I have to like. I I need this kid helping my daughter. So I stayed up there. They’re like, all right, like like she paid extra money for the guide service and I stayed up there for the length of the time that we are on that course for and like are around like the 50% Mark like I was talking about she would like start to like stop crying and be like, yeah, I’m doing it and we be like, yeah, and if you like that for every single element like she didn’t quite like understand like that. That’s how it would always be like it would be okay. But yeah all in all. I I did not care how long it was gonna take. I would have been up there all eight hours for my shift if I had to help this girl, you know, because she is human although she’s a tiny human at this point in her life. She’s still a human. You know, she might understand she might not understand like complex thoughts like we do as adults, but I I understood in that moment in time. the the dire Developmental stage that she was in at that moment of her lifetime. and I wanted. To give her an experience that she might carry with her through her life. Be like yo like This person stayed up there with me. for x amount of time and was willing to be there for longer and give me all of his effort to help me with something, you know, like I I wrote this down I wrote down that humans are people, you know humans are like Human race biology and everything but like we’re also people like down to our soul, you know, like we need to treat. humans with emotion like like they are people, you know. So I don’t care if it’s a seven year old that’s a person that’s a person and their devil developmental stage. Like that’s like really important you

Maggie:
Sure

Rich:
You cannot mess them up. Like like if if you slip at that point in their life, they might carry that and have some trouble

Maggie:
For sure, you know.

Rich:
No pressure, no pressure. No pressure to the parents out there. It’s hard shout out, you know? Don’t worry. I got you. Yeah, you’re a great dad. You’re good at that. Thanks. Um. yeah, she told me at the end of the course the mother she told me about how happy she was with the service that I gave and how willing I was to do all of that. And more if I had to and in the daughter was really happy. She didn’t want to go in another course after that the time was up to but she was all like I am proud of myself, and I was cool. I did my job. I I did what I had to do, you know, I I admit I’m not the best. At that job sometimes like I said, it’s not natural for me. I’m not a natural climber. Sometimes my anxiety gets the best of me recently the past year. I had to do a lower which I struggle with a little bit because I was getting my head with my anxiety. And I I messed up the lower in a supervisor had to come up and help me. Like I said, I love the management there. They’re really encouraging they were like, it’s okay like this happens. Like I was still getting my head about it, you know, so like, oh, I’m not perfect with that stuff, you know, but like what I can say, I’m very proud of is my people skills. And I’m happy I get the chance at times at that job to give people. A good Human Experience. Yeah for sure five stars did five star storytelling, too and thanks for sharing that you. I wrote down empathy because Maggie said it but then I was like that really captures I think. The heart of what you’re saying you it sounded like you were putting yourself in. The Frame of Mind of a seven year old kid, you know, like trying to understand where she was coming from with those things and And I think that really is if what I said, it holds true going out of your way on behalf of others. I mean, that’s just easier. when you are thinking about the way another person is feeling and trying to Meet them there and accommodate you know, where they are. Yeah, that’s I think a principle Hospitality.

Maggie:
Yeah.

Rich:
Um, I got a story for you. so I okay. All right. Shout out to the algorithm. Did the algorithm is always showing me the best stuff in my life. I found an Instagram feed of of a and I actually I think it’s older guys about this because I was just so stoked about it. I found this coffee company the showed up as a sponsored post on my feed that they had a real and I clicked it because it was total clickbait and it was Is a company called Two Rivers coffee? Yes Number Two Rivers coffee. Okay, not like TW number two. And so they just had us they had a really sick. Like real that was yep sponsored. Oh,

Maggie:
Yeah,

Rich:
And I I watched that I went through and I was scrolling all the way through and here’s what they do dude this blew my mind. They instead of they just have like a traditional Instagram feed. You know what I mean? Like just post after post except that each post instead of being a boring picture. It’s its own real. Yep. It’s a video. Yeah, and so imagine I describe these in one case they just have like Let’s see if I can find it in one case. There’s literally just this video of of I’m showing I’m showing you guys for those who are Seeing what’s happening right now. There’s a Chemex in the background. There’s a coffee sleeve with the brand stamps on it. And that’s all just propped up on top of this like bar top kind of thing that you put cups on. Yeah, and there’s like pretty lights flickering in the background, but it’s like blurred because it’s like portrait mode kind of vibe, you know. And and then oh, there’s good music to it. Sorry, I tap that there’s music playing to the post as well, which I know you can do that with a regular photo nowadays, but then there so this one doesn’t have I don’t think these words are changing these words were changing. No,

Maggie:
They’re not changing. So

Rich:
The words are stationary static words, but on other posts, they’ll have the words change out. So there’s no voiceover. There’s just like Words going through but then everything there’s like a Vibe. They got this old like Weather Channel thing going on.

Maggie:
Are you taking notes for your own Instagram?

Rich:
I’m just talking about all everywhere I go obsessed. Okay, right here gift card pretty photo words going over the top. It’s just a Cool vibe. So I’m like rather than just do boring pictures. There’s like life to all their posts. They’re going through, you know, and then each one has music and so they basically replaced your traditional Instagram feed with reels, but not in the way that people do realize. I really don’t know how to describe it

Maggie:
Not in a way of like voiceovers and like dancing but in just like An Ambiance.

Rich:
Yeah, they just do a great job of capturing like the vibe with with these these posts. I did comments on it to my friend. Okay, here’s what I said. I was like, I will say I’ve never seen a fee that straight up replaced photos with reels. It’s like cooler pictures. It’s not like the popular slash Trend your reels just to do real. It’s like borrowing the familiarity of the photo feed but replacing it with something 1,000 times more engaging. That’s how I described it. And I’m obviously still raving about it. So here’s what I did. Okay, there’s here’s where the hospitality comes in. First of all shoutouts are just having a sick. Shout out to the hospitality experience of like just create just providing an engaging Instagram feed for some random coffee shop that you would otherwise look at and just have to be bored by you know feed so okay message them and I was like, hi. Y’all have the literal sickest feed on Instagram across all genres and I wish I live less than a thousand miles away so I can visit LOL. So I just sent them that message out of the blue for my personal profile not my shop profile. Yeah, he get okay. Here’s the response. Hey, thanks, Rich. What’s a good shipping address for you? I’ll send you some good. I’ll send you some good since you reached out. No, yeah, we’re kidding me. Yeah.

Maggie:
Yeah.

Rich:
I was like no. Sorry also good to me and I probably address

Maggie:
That’s amazing. They just right off the ripped and even

Rich:
Don’t twice dude like so much love. Thanks for reaching out. We’ll send you something. You can’t come to us. We’ll send you something. Yeah. Thanks for noticing what we’re doing. Yeah. Are you kidding me? This this is literally the Pinnacle of Hospital experience for me.

Maggie:
That’s

Rich:
I’m gonna go on Google give these guys five stars and I’ve never even been there dude. Yes, and now I have a story to tell about that company and when I go to New Braunfels, Texas, which will probably never happen. I know where I’m going. I would rather go it’s not so far from Austin that if I ever got to Austin I wouldn’t go

Maggie:
But I mean, that’s the point. They just proved my point.

Rich:
Okay

Maggie:
From before right of giving somebody that That has fitable experience like right off the rip like you don’t even hear of

Rich:
Theirs. Yeah,

Maggie:
You know never been there. You’re just like

Rich:
You’re not even like a prospect.

Maggie:
Yeah and like how cool is that

Rich:
Now? They’re gonna free shout out on a podcast

Maggie:
Exactly.

Rich:
I

Maggie:
Mean and you free free coffee like that is so like take note like that is so cool. I

Rich:
Don’t even care if they never do shit be something. I’m like fine. I’ll just I’ll just assume we got lost in the mail. Yeah. It’s like a celebrity like like the answer alone like yeah, it tickles the soul. There’s sure. Yeah. So what about them is this how they’re like artists like like the way they talk the way that they create everything like that, you know, they’re like we’re creating this thing and like our own little corner. And we’re marketing it really well. You know grasping for any possible straw strategically to get noticed. Yeah, and that’s happening. And and they’re like, yes, like you noticed us like thank you. Yeah, like you can’t even consume our product. You can’t even come up to our store but the fact that you noticed us and like what we do and like what we make like that that’s all we need. Yeah me as an artist like that. That’s all I need. Like if I if I get like a comment on some tiktok I made with like some vibe. And in someone’s like yeah, that’s a dope Vibe. You know, I I just made this like ad to advertise my my new song that just came out yesterday with my band and my boys Zach much loves Zach. I love you. He texted me. He was like, yo, man. I just want to let you know that. Like that video was hard to not watch like I really enjoyed it and I can’t wait to hear the song and I was like dude. Thank you so much. Like I struggle so much with social media. Like it’s it’s like a constant me too. That’s probably why I love I I don’t like social media ultimately, but I know it’s necessary to maintain a good business. So the fact that it’s it’s noticed that I I created something good with yeah

Maggie:
With

Rich:
Like a Vibe, you know, that that resonates with the brand of my business.

Maggie:
Are we following two rivers on our house coffee?

Rich:
Oh, yeah, but

Maggie:
We should follow them

Rich:
And I was just think I just took a screenshot of that text that I read.

Maggie:
Okay

Rich:
Since my friend, maybe I’ll send that to them too and just be like, yeah. Getting all the shoutouts. Yeah

Maggie:
What we should follow

Rich:
That that is a massive W for Two Rivers. Yes so so much. So the principles at play here. This this is where I may. I don’t know. I don’t know if we have to part to it. I mean I enjoy talking with you. So I mean maybe just for that just for that sake. Yeah. I have a lot of notes like I can keep chatting. Yeah, dude. I don’t want to dive in anything nice that you got.

Maggie:
Well, I was just gonna

Rich:
You Yeah, so let’s summarize because here’s what I think I would like to do is is have and this is where I thought this wouldn’t would go but we just we had a lot more ground. We ended up covering a lot more ground. I would love to talk a little more specifically maybe take some of these principles. So we’ll summarize his principles and then we’ll I’d love to bring them up again. I don’t know if it’s next time or just a future episode, but I’d love to talk through these things these principles and if there’s a couple more to add and then how we personally want them applied in our businesses. Yeah, and in particular like our work environments, so With the podcast. How could we do it in your real estate business? How could you do it a story? How could we do it? And if you want to talk on music, you know, I’d love to see how we would personally take those things and like see ourselves applying them and almost set a bar that we can be like holding ourselves accountable to actually because for me a story that I always wanted a hospital experience, but if I were to say You’ve asked me are you giving that experience of people? I’m usually like no. No, I’m not but I think maybe revisiting that whole concept of this is why I’m on this topic because I just like, I’ve really been chewing on the idea of hospitality and I want that in my business at this point. So and I think and I’m gonna put this out there. I think that we’re in a day and age where Anyone can do what you do? But they can’t give the hospitable experience that the way you can right always or like to the degree you’re willing to do it. So coffee shops come and go but like

Maggie:
Hospitality however

Rich:
You but how’s Italy’s forever? Yes, exactly. Exactly. And that’s gonna be true really in anything. And so I I actually would like to I would like to continue this one. Can you summarize what you were gonna say?

Maggie:
Well that’s gonna say something so I wrote down what are the key principles and I the two I wrote down were empathy and engagement.

Rich:
The can you say a word or two on engagement?

Maggie:
Engagement in feed is what I actually wrote but I just think I gave you. Yeah, but I also think it’s important. like for for the sake of a coffee shop like the engagement you make a point to remember everybody’s name

Rich:
Engagement with your guests with your clients. If you will engagements on another level with your deeper clients. Okay, love it. Yeah, I’m with you on the yeah in the water. I say I kind of had a definition of like going out of your way the engagement. Going out of your way. Cool. Did you another one?

Maggie:
No, TJ. I said empathy. Yeah,

Rich:
Um and and this this is You can name the episode this this is good. All right. Are you ready for it? That one liners one-liners? All right. So hospitality is humanity. Sammy colon humans are people quick bait for sure. All right. Well, you heard it here first at that sentence is so loaded with like information on how to look at it You know. You might have known back that. All right, like you just have to really dissect that sentence like take an English.

Maggie:
I don’t know. I like mine better which was like coffee shops or temporary Hospital dude. I like right.

Rich:
Okay. Yes. I don’t know which one so very Hospitality as part one is one and part 2 the other and we’ll just have to fight about which one is

Maggie:
Right.

Rich:
I have a good part two title as well here another way. Yeah, dude, I’m thinking ahead.

Maggie:
Never mind

Rich:
Classic TJ. All right, five stars, you know, just

Maggie:
Trying to be like the third co-host or something.

Rich:
I I I’ve been wanted to be on a podcast for so long. I have so much to say it’s the summer of TJ. Okay. I’m in my demon era right now. I don’t know what that means that that means screw the world. I’m doing what I want. Oh, okay. There’s a word for that. Yeah, cool. I’m happy for you.

Maggie:
Well, those of you listening you can do what you want. But also please rate and review our podcast and send in your feedback. Please we

Rich:
Yes

Maggie:
We want to hear back from you and we want to know what you think. So shout us out at House Coffee podcast at gmail.com for a direct email or House Coffee podcast.com for a speakpipe. Leave us a message or always follow us. At House Coffee podcast on Instagram until next time later.